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FrostDragonfly
Dec 07, 2008, 04:22 PM
1) Map Cycle:
GOLDRUSH
DUSTBOWL
2FORT
Granary
Well
Gravel Pit
Badlands
Arena?


2) Team Size:
9v9 Highlander


3) Best 5 of 9 maps to win
(rules to win a match)


4) Dates:
Every Saturday night.
12/21/08 Deadline
tourney starts in January


im lookin for some input here.
we need to start giving more details.

getthere1tme
Dec 07, 2008, 05:27 PM
Mapcycle:

Dustbowl
Gold Rush
2fort
Granary
cp_well
Gravel Pit
Badlands

randomized obv


Team Size:

I recommend 6v6 but nothing bigger than 9v9. 12v12 would be hard to get together and the larger the demoninator, the more people will be left behind

Dates:

I recommended in the other thread that sign ups end at 12/21/08 and we start in Jan after the holiday. This allows everyone to sign up and some time over the holidays to organize things.

FrostDragonfly
Dec 07, 2008, 05:34 PM
i'd really prefer not to do 6v6 because class choices become VERY limited

2 scout 2 soldier 1 medic 1 demo

snipers spies heavies engies etc. all become useless at that size
and i think 9 is closer to our regular pub play-style than 6's

getthere1tme
Dec 07, 2008, 05:43 PM
highlander then? 8v8?

FrostDragonfly
Dec 07, 2008, 06:01 PM
leanin towards highlander.

but better if we took a poll.

Half-Duplex
Dec 07, 2008, 08:38 PM
Dates should be two times a week. Once on Saturday, and once sometime in the middle, say Wednesday.

Zeitgeist
Dec 07, 2008, 08:59 PM
as long as they are after 4pm mountain time im good to go.

i agree we should vote on team sizes/other rules and let everyone know if they want an opinion they need to register on the boards

wieks
Dec 07, 2008, 11:59 PM
i'd really prefer not to do 6v6 because class choices become VERY limited

2 scout 2 soldier 1 medic 1 demo

snipers spies heavies engies etc. all become useless at that size
and i think 9 is closer to our regular pub play-style than 6's

yea 9v9 would be best...

after all its a competition between server pub
not a clan comp here... and yea a full 32man or even 12v12 would be near impossible to obtain so i would say they next best thing would be the 9v9 choice...

Isuxdix
Dec 08, 2008, 10:49 AM
I was in the 2fort servers shilling the idea for the tourney (they were, for the most part, uninterested) and they brought up a good point that a lot of people that play 2fort servers are really only interested in playing 2fort. I said that I assumed tournament would probably not be 2fort due to a bias (I assumed the same for goldrush) but that was when I thought the tournament was a one day thing. So I don't know, is it a bad idea to use Goldrush and 2fort when certain servers specialize with it?

I love the highlander idea.

Retro
Dec 08, 2008, 10:58 AM
is it a bad idea to use Goldrush and 2fort when certain servers specialize with it?


I probably would of agreed with you until last night. Many regulars on the goldrush server, myself included, were getting an uncomfortable dose of rape from not so regulars. Also, any advantage we do have on goldrush would be outweighed on how much time we don't have on other maps.

getthere1tme
Dec 08, 2008, 11:16 AM
I think it's only fair that 2fort and Gold Rush get used since Valve Maps players are going to know the other maps a ton better in general. But that's only if we hold a season. I think a straight up tourn will be too short to DEFINITELY include these maps but they should be more heavily weighted in any randomization process.

Duplex, I think that twice a week will be too much for some people. I also think the "when" of us playing these matches is going to be a big problem.

Our first option is to have matches on a set date and time. This makes it easier because we know when each match is being played far in advance and makes life easier on DF. The downside is that scheduled matches (on weekends) might not be the best for some people and we may not be able to get everyone together. The other option is to schedule 1 match a week and let teams play whenever they can both organize at any point during that week. The problem with this is that it makes things very hard on DF as far as the overseeing things good. An alternative is finding some other private server space for this tourney but I don't know how realistic that is. Scheduling for the weekend is probably the lesser of two evils.

There's also the matter of team selection. We haven't really discussed it yet but I'm assuming that people will just make their own teams by getting together and asking. The people left over will either be randomized into their own team or be alternates. There are other options like complete randomization or drafting, but in randomization you might not get to play with the people you want to and a draft would take forever.

FrostDragonfly
Dec 08, 2008, 04:15 PM
yea, retro brings a good point
our time spent will be outweighed by the lack of time spent on other maps for sure. so it would be fair if we included it. if anything, u guys already have an edge by experiencing all the maps pretty equally.

so u cap a point by standing on it?


also as far as team making goes, i do think we should make our own teams.
regulars know each other pretty well, and in deciding which teams, we get to optimize which class we play.

cuz nobody wants to see me play as a sniper or spy lol.

Isuxdix
Dec 08, 2008, 04:35 PM
Are you saying you should build like 2-3 teams once you decide amongst yourselves?

Like I said in another post, I kind of want to make so that the best of the best of one server gets to face the best of the best of the best of another server. But I also want everybody to play. So I don't know if we should have one awesome team and then a secondary (or third) team of scrubs which can also sub as alternates? And the scrubs from each server could face each other? Or maybe trade off players that aren't doing so well for alternates until everyone plays.. like arena kind of?

I really don't like the idea of randomizing either because of your point. Might have people playing classes they never play and we wouldn't get the best vs. the best scenario. But maybe we could randomize the teams by the class that they play? IDK just throwin out ideas.

And I agree that it is biased with any map used unless it's a custom map not used on any of the servers but I don't think I like that idea. So I suppose the best way is to use all the valve maps and randomize or whatev.

Zeitgeist
Dec 08, 2008, 04:40 PM
yeah i think if we are allowed to make out own teams its going to look pretty clan-stacked. i think we should devise a way to determine who the "best" player is for each class and make a "dream team" "all star team" kind of thing. like the olympics.

FrostDragonfly
Dec 08, 2008, 04:42 PM
yea, we want ace teams.
but i think we should make secondary teams as well, in the situation where we have...like 24 participants?

also im assuming we're doing like best of 3 or 5 maps?

getthere1tme
Dec 08, 2008, 04:51 PM
What's wrong with the clan stack? My guys are invited into my clan because I think they're the best of the best on this server. I know when they're all on my team I can depend on them to listen to me and to work well together. Regardless of what your, "dream team" they're never going to have the same synergy. Likewise with pHd, some people hate Duplex and some people will work well with him. On the wrong team, he could be a disaster and on the right team he could be a huge help. It's not as though any teams formed wont be top notch anyway. Having some kind of preliminary to figure out who's best at what class is silly because we each have our strengths and weaknesses.

Schwarz
Dec 08, 2008, 05:04 PM
What's wrong with the clan stack? My guys are invited into my clan because I think they're the best of the best on this server. I know when they're all on my team I can depend on them to listen to me and to work well together. Regardless of what your, "dream team" they're never going to have the same synergy. Likewise with pHd, some people hate Duplex and some people will work well with him. On the wrong team, he could be a disaster and on the right team he could be a huge help. It's not as though any teams formed wont be top notch anyway. Having some kind of preliminary to figure out who's best at what class is silly because we each have our strengths and weaknesses.

WINNER

Isuxdix
Dec 08, 2008, 05:08 PM
Well map rotation will be important. Since we are gonna have Goldrush we need to include 2fort even though everyone outside of 2fort servers hates it (though I'm not even sure the 2fort server players are really participating and all I am seeing is Valve Maps vs Goldrush).

Two of each type of map? Attack vs. Defense, Capture Point, CTF, and Payload? Problem with payload and AvD is there is obvious advantages to each side, so we would have to play each twice, at least.

Well_cp
Badlands_cp
2Fort_ctf
Turbine_ctf
Goldrush_pl
Badwater Basin_pl
Dustbowl_cp
Gravelpit_cp

I pretty much hate the CTF maps and fastlane so I guess we should probably make a poll thread on which maps to include.
Arena was suggested? I kind of dislike Arena anymore, so I have a bias.

Best 5 of 9 sounds good to me but I don't care about that. I think that depends on how we are doing the tournament, like if each server has 2-3 teams then we might just want to best 2 out of 3 so there isn't too much waiting.

Isuxdix
Dec 08, 2008, 05:24 PM
What's wrong with the clan stack? My guys are invited into my clan because I think they're the best of the best on this server. I know when they're all on my team I can depend on them to listen to me and to work well together. Regardless of what your, "dream team" they're never going to have the same synergy. Likewise with pHd, some people hate Duplex and some people will work well with him. On the wrong team, he could be a disaster and on the right team he could be a huge help. It's not as though any teams formed wont be top notch anyway. Having some kind of preliminary to figure out who's best at what class is silly because we each have our strengths and weaknesses.

Because that's missing the point of the reason we have this competition. If it was clan tournament, then great, I think it would work well and your team would honestly probably win and I would enjoy watching that... but it's not, it's a server vs server and I would much rather see Mr. Boo working with Krylon working with IamtheBOOKIE working with Whitefox working with `yay because they are the best or damn close to it of each class.

A group of friends/clan war might be the way to go to forego all the bullshit of trying to choose the best of the best team... but so will a poll.
I'm ok with either one really, but I prefer server vs. server because it's like the Olympic Dream Team and seems like it's far more interesting than your usual clan battles.

FrostDragonfly
Dec 08, 2008, 05:30 PM
i agree with isux

its a server tourny.
...goldrush CLAN BASED LOL?!
if we randomize maps, maybe we should randomize per type.
1 payload 1 cp 1 ctf 1 arena last one random.

yea we should decide on a atk/def scoring system (someone mentioned stopwatch)
ace team vs ace team 5/9 but our other teams need to do something too, we'll figure that out.

also as far as servers go, i kinda notice that our sourceop arena server is empty a lot, maybe we can borrow that for our "tourny"

getthere1tme
Dec 08, 2008, 06:10 PM
I'm not suggesting it be clan based. I'm simply suggesting that we form our own teams. The best of the best of the best is fine and dandy but how do you come to that conclusion? Votes? lol. A tournament? too long. Why don't we just have a bunch of guys who think they're the best get together? It may not be optimal but I think I can build a pretty damn good team and Isux thinks he can do pretty well himself. And why wouldn't you want to play with your friends? If you're a regular you should have friends on the server and if you don't by now then you must be one hateful bastard. Also, as I've stated before, a dream team isnt necessarily the best of each class, players that compliment each other are important too.

Edit:

Isux, you seem to be thinking this'll just be one big game of the best on the server vs the best on the other. I was proposing that we play something like a season, where we only play teams from other servers, and then the teams with the best record play in a "Super Bowl"

For example, lets say we vote or whatever for team #1 and the second choices go to team #2. Well what if team #2 performs better? It's not so far fetched.

Zeitgeist
Dec 08, 2008, 07:27 PM
i think they are both good ideas, we just need to separate them, and make that distinction clear. in fact, i think we should do both of them (a season of choose your own teams, and an all-star giant best out of 5 server vs server battle)

Drbumpy
Dec 09, 2008, 09:13 PM
*I* think we need to find a list of participants for each server and sort them into teams of a given number limit based on which people would have the worst synergies with each other.